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Post by bromptonaut on Feb 6, 2022 13:01:14 GMT
I obviously have no idea, but it would seem strange to think that house builders are not permitted to donate, support or vote for the Labour Party. But this is far too ridiculous to actually bother continuing. You raised the point!! Or is too ridiculous to actually bother continuing code for 'I got it wrong'? I'm no expert in the marketing and pricing of newbuild homes but I suspect there is a fairly clear price for which a bog standard four bed family home on an estate will sell in South Northamptonshire; let's say £450k. If regulations require those newbuilds to incorporate £10,000 extra costs for heat pumps, solar panels and rainwater collection there's no certainty that they can then sell their places for £460k; less profit per unit. The big housebuilders all believe that a Tory government is likely to be less interventionist and more in favour of 'letting the market decide' than a Labour government with a green wind in its sails. OK the numbers are simplistic but I think they illustrate my point.
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Feb 6, 2022 13:23:35 GMT
I obviously have no idea, but it would seem strange to think that house builders are not permitted to donate, support or vote for the Labour Party. But this is far too ridiculous to actually bother continuing. I have no data on equivalent donations to Labour, but even if they are significant, which I doubt, Labour is not in government and hasn’t been for 12 years. But the FT reported in August 2021 that a quarter of the Conservative Party’s income since Johnson became leader — £18m in two years — has come from those whose business is property. Do you suppose greater regulation and higher minimum energy efficiency standards are high on their quid pro quo list?
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Post by EspadaIII on Feb 6, 2022 14:27:19 GMT
What is not realised by many people yet (it will dawn soon), is that the investment in raintwater harvesting, solar panels, improved insulation etc all of which will reduce running costs of a house, will start to affect in a positive sense the value of a property. Eventually, just like with the fuel economy figures of a car, people will choosde to buy a house with lower running costs. At the moment the difference between houses is modest and people may prefer an older, less efficient house which has far more character. But eventually if a house costs £2,000 a year more to live in compared to a similar house, it may have a value of up to £25,000/£30,000 more.
I am astonished that our Building Regulations are so unimpressive. If you are going to install insulation anyway, adding another 50mm is not so expensive. If you are going to install double glazing, adding triple glazing is not so much more expensive. Yes a solar panelled roof or a heat pump are expensive but you could start by requiring their installation on new build houses above a certain size or sale price. At a certain point the additional cost is a drop in the ocean compared to the house price anyway.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2022 15:35:18 GMT
I obviously have no idea, but it would seem strange to think that house builders are not permitted to donate, support or vote for the Labour Party. But this is far too ridiculous to actually bother continuing. You raised the point!! Or is too ridiculous to actually bother continuing code for 'I got it wrong'? No, it's literal for "too ridiculous to actually bother continuing". Pretty clear, really.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2022 15:37:02 GMT
I obviously have no idea, but it would seem strange to think that house builders are not permitted to donate, support or vote for the Labour Party. But this is far too ridiculous to actually bother continuing. Do you suppose greater regulation and higher minimum energy efficiency standards are high on their quid pro quo list? I have no idea, why are you asking me?
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Feb 6, 2022 16:31:08 GMT
Because Do you mean that all housebuilders are tory donors? I didn’t say ‘all’ anything. But businesses and businesspeople do not make political donations because they have money they don’t know what to do with. The Tories depend on that money and do whatever is legal (and sometimes what isn’t, Robert Jenrick) to keep their donors happy.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2022 17:34:02 GMT
One would assume, and I don't know, that various developers would like Labour to build council houses and the like. Which I suppose would have much that same effect.
I've never yet someone whose decency, integrity or honesty had anything to do with their political allegiance.
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Post by WDB on Feb 6, 2022 18:24:00 GMT
So the donations to the Tories are entirely altruistic? Nothing to do with proposals to ease planning constraints, keep property taxes low, avoiding taxing land banks or wealth held as property, generally keep treating housing as a means of making money rather than a basic need and human right...?
I can't dispute your experience but anecdote is not evidence. There are - or used to be - decent Tories. But most that were have been purged since it became the English Nationalist Party, which will now take whatever advantage it can to secure its position in power. And if you think the latest Tory power grab - politicising the Electoral Commission, disenfranchising poorer voters by requiring photo ID, and removing fair voting from PCC and Mayoral elections - is anything but corrupt, you've been isolated from UK politics for too long.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2022 20:12:10 GMT
>>So the donations to the Tories are entirely altruistic? Nothing to do with proposals to ease planning constraints, keep property taxes low, avoiding taxing land banks or wealth held as property, generally keep treating housing as a means of making money rather than a basic need and human right...?
Why are you asking me? If you have an opinion, why not give it?
In my opinion and experience, donations from anyone to anyone are usually not altruistic and are usually for selfish reasons. Irrespective of which political party they purport to prefer.
>>I can't dispute your experience but anecdote is not evidence.
My statement began "I have never yet met..." I made no statement beyond a comment on my own experience. In that it is me telling of my own experience, how can it be anything other than anecdotal. I have no idea of what what I should be giving evidence.
In any case. this is a discussion forum, not a court of law and in my opinion the ironic or sarcastic asking of a question is a very weak form of discussion. Generally I think it's more sneering than discussing, which rarely seems to be the action of someone in a position of strength.
>>There are - or used to be - decent Tories.
I can only repeat, that I have never yet someone whose decency, integrity or honesty had anything to do with their political allegiance. Party politics is a crap approach.
As for the rest of your post, which I actually didn't read with much care, I do wonder if you will be providing evidence. Because you know what they say about anecdote......
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Post by WDB on Apr 12, 2022 13:23:17 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2022 13:50:13 GMT
I don't really know what I think about this.
That Boris would break the law, certainly insofar as inconvenient regulations, us not a surprise or revelation.
The outraged wailing of other politicians is just hypocritical and self-serving noise and certainly of no import, value or interest.
Ditto media whining.
That he lied to other politicians, themselves a disgraceful bunch of lying wasters, also doesn't bother me much.
I'm not really bothered about the regulation breaking in and of itself. I broke some Covid rules, deliberately. I often break rules.
The thing that does bother me is his stupidity. I've been in difficult and publicly visible situations and above all else one makes sure to be lily white and above reproach.
To do otherwise is just stupid.
Boris Johnson is either stupid, or he thinks himself above everybody else, probably both. And I am certainly tired of constant reminders of those two things.
I see no sign of his behaviour changing. And that is another level of stupidity.
He should go, we just shouldn't think we're going to get anything better in his place.
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Post by WDB on Apr 12, 2022 14:11:13 GMT
For the moment, I don’t care. Johnson has had his fun and taken us for mugs for far too long. He’s overdue for an ignominious exit. I’d like to see that followed by a general election but I’m not hopeful that enough thin-margin Tories will have the courage to vote for that.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2022 14:22:18 GMT
I agree that he should go, preferably with his tail between his legs and with a tarnished reputation.
But dear God, look at the alternatives! And as for a GE, unless a new and improved Liberal Democrat Party drops through a wormhole how is that going to improve things?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2022 15:01:09 GMT
Even as a LibDem member myself, I think the Labour Party is new and improved enough now to be an acceptable replacement to lead a government. It is certainly a more attractive option than continuing with the current shitshow. There is seldom an optimal choice in front of us. Least worst option is the way.
I are sad that my party isn't up to it sorry to say, but could provide an acceptable coalition with Labour in the circumstances, were the 2 parties clever enough to work together at an election and get as many Tories out as possible.
Johnson should resign, he won't. His party should then remove him, they won't. There is no other mechanism. We need a refreshed voting system and constitution, with an elected Head of State on the Irish model, with limited constitutional powers, one who could be, right now, calling Johnson in for a quiet chat and requiring his resignation. Our current constitutional arrangements have proven several times over in the last few years to be insufficient against a "bad actor" in Downing Street and a disgraced government. This isn't the first time they should have fallen. It won't be the last, but they will continue. And then, imagine a hung Parliament with fewer Tories than Labour, but more of the popular vote going Tory in 2024. In those circumstances, the government is not required to stand down. Follow this thread and tell me you can't see this happening and Johnson powering on in to dictatorship...
This country needs an enema.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2022 15:13:56 GMT
Johnson is a dick, but a "bad actor" or potential dictator? No, that's over zealous campaigning. He's a dick in much the same way that they all are.
A reform of the electoral system to artificially address the current situation is one approach. Trying to get people to show an interest beyond newspaper headlines is another.
Politicians will do and say whatever it takes to first get themselves elected and second to stay in office. Nothing matters to them more than that. If people voted according to real opinions on real issues and then re-elected on performance, the whole problem would go away, whatever the system.
Sadly as politicians have got better at spinning and the media has got better at manipulating while the audience has become less educated and less enquiring, then we have been accelerating in the opposite direction. I don't see any obvious change looming.
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