WDB
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Post by WDB on Mar 26, 2024 7:15:15 GMT
I deliberately said road tax instead of VED for you to respond. I really did You know me so well. 😳 You’re right that I don’t do much public charging, although that will increase a bit when I replace the CLS. And that (and updating my heating system at home) will also make it viable to move to a time-sensitive home energy tariff, so the charging portion of my electricity bill will come right down. There was certainly a fracture in the used market when the £40,000 threshold was introduced in 2017. I looked at a few CLSes made that late in the run, although they were only a few months old then and generally above my budget anyway. The thought of an extra £2,000 in lifetime cost seemed significant when I could avoid it by simply choosing a car a few weeks older; not a choice open to the new buyers the government probably had in mind. I hope the post-election government will delay introducing this change, to undo some of the damage done to EV adoption by Sunak’s crowd-pleasing.
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Mar 26, 2024 7:31:36 GMT
Incidentally, while I may not do much public — and especially rapid — charging, looking at used EVs makes me wonder who has. We’ve been conditioned over a couple of decades not to worry about well-used ICEs, because they suffer more from neglect than they do from exercise.
More recently, we’ve learned not to worry about EV batteries because, treated with care, they’re just fine for years and years. But over-frequent rapid charging can spoil that, which makes me wary of a car that’s done 40,000 miles in two years in a way I wouldn’t have been in the fossil era. You could, of course, drive 200 miles every working day, charge at home overnight, and cover 40,000 miles in a year without touching a rapid charger. But if a car’s been run as a company vehicle, with its charging costs paid centrally, its driver seems more likely to have favoured expediency over battery conservation, and rapid-charged with gay abandon. And when there are so many that have been much more lightly used, it’s a risk I don’t need to take.
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bpg
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Post by bpg on Mar 26, 2024 9:22:32 GMT
A standardised state of health indication of the battery would be welcome, I'm sure it will come though that doesn't help people now looking at used EVs.
Tesla are rather bullish about fast charging, battery health and used car values. I was looking yesterday at their website. Three year old model Ys with 130,000 Kms plus and the price is still over €53k. I wouldn't buy one but some folks must be.
The new European Ford Explorer EV, Europe only model, launches today. I've read it's between Focus Estate and Kuga size. Should be interesting comparing prices and specs with what is already in that segment.
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Mar 26, 2024 10:47:56 GMT
Their EVs seem to be depreciating far worse than equivalents, however… Curious about this. I’m not sure how true it is but I’m prepared to be convinced. One factor may be that VW has a new set of drivetrains to replace the 60-80 in the Enyaq and the 35-40-50 in the Q4, so the previous models are now recognisably obsolete. Trouble is, the new motor with RWD - 45 in meaningless Audi terms - looks like the new sweet spot in the range, usefully quicker without the efficiency drag of 4WD. So I’d rather have one of those - supposing I like a car I’ve not even sat in yet. Back in Reading tomorrow morning. I might get brave (hey, I’m already going to Reading) this time and ring the dealer first.
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Mar 26, 2024 11:01:41 GMT
Tesla are rather bullish about fast charging, battery health and used car values. I was looking yesterday at their website. Three year old model Ys with 130,000 Kms plus and the price is still over €53k. I wouldn't buy one but some folks must be. No Ys that old on the UK site (or in the UK?) or anything so well exercised. You can have a 2022 with 46k for £41,000, which probably says more about the difference in our countries’ used markets. But £30,000 for a basic 2021 Model 3 seems steep when you look at prices for newer European and Korean cars. The Supercharger message plays loud with Tesla buyers, which possibly makes their cars an easier sell to nervous adopters, or their nervous spouses. That said, I do miss the days when I felt admiration for Tesla and wanted to own one.
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bpg
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Post by bpg on Mar 26, 2024 11:23:44 GMT
Their naming does look all over the place. A used for saloons, hatchbacks and estates Q for Quattro indicating an SUV but they also have quattro equipped A cars TT now obsolete R now obsolete RS was reserved for one special model in the whole range, now just another piece of marketing.
S for sporting cars S3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 then SQ5, 7, 8.
Why aren't the S5, 7 & 8 not named SA5, 7 & 8 which would then rename the S3, 4 & 6 SA3, 4 & 6 for consistency. Then the numbers, they don't represent horsepower or kW leaving gaps between the bands. Does this mean we can look forward to and SQ5 57.5 with 408PS or 300kW sitting somewhere between a 55 and 60 ? I may go have a play with the Audi configurator see if I can induce a migraine.
And you all thought Germans were programmed with Teutonic logic grounded in rational purpose. 🤣🤣🤣
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Mar 26, 2024 11:41:11 GMT
I suppose BMW ran into a similar problem with the X series, once they wanted to work M into it too. And around the same time, they gave up relating the model number to the engine size, so perhaps the next logical step is to break the link entirely. I’d not thought of Q being for Quattro (especially as the branding has been emphatically lower-case q for 40 years) but you can have your Q4 with RWD only, so if it did once fit, it no longer does.
And then there’s the whole ‘e-tron’ naming thing, which started with a PHEV, then became a model in its own right, then a prefix to ‘GT’, now is back to being a suffix - just before Škoda decided to drop the redundant ‘IV’ from the Enyaq. Does one ask one’s French valeter, “Pouvez-vous polir mon étron?”
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Post by EspadaIII on Mar 26, 2024 11:46:25 GMT
I have long considered Audi to be the chavs of the motoring world. It's all about 'look at me' with recent higher end models. Mind you I saw a BMW i7 this morning. Cor that is one 'in yer face motherf****r'. I remember the days when a 7-series was a sensible if sportier competitor for S-classes and similar.
It is no surprise that people like me who could afford to get cars such as the e-tron or various BMW EVs just looked at various cars and their tech specs and said - actually I will have the best EV tech with a really interesting body and easy to use interior without wasting money; so we went for Hyundai or Kia. Seeing lots of I5s around now, and I would say that very few appear to be driven by 'motor geeks' but by regualr people and gosh- lots of women.
I suspect that range anxiety which sold lots of Teslas is gradually easing and with that people are buying the best EVs for their purpose rather than the one which simply calms their nerves on a rarely taken long journey.
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Mar 26, 2024 12:11:53 GMT
I have long considered Audi to be the chavs of the motoring world. It's all about 'look at me' with recent higher end models. It used to be that the bigger models in all the German makers’ lineups were generally more discreet and decorous, with the look-at-me stuff concentrated at the lower end, to appeal to the brashness of yoof. Not so much now, as Esp notes. Maybe it’s about establishing brand identity in emerging markets rather than vying for a bigger share of a saturated European one. BMW’s front ends get more absurd with every new model — and less and less like any ‘kidney’ that shouldn’t be in Intensive Care. Audi went too far when the grille bit the bumper in half. But Mercedes seems to be morphing into blobby anonymity. The EQE may be aerodynamic but it has no discernible shape at all.
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bpg
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Post by bpg on Mar 26, 2024 13:24:13 GMT
Does one ask one’s French valeter, “Pouvez-vous polir mon étron?” If you don't want it polished you could always just get it washed down some backstreet. New Explorer fully loaded with long range battery and rear motor 286PS with 570kms range €55½k list.
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Mar 26, 2024 14:15:02 GMT
Or £50k here, plus £1000 for a heat pump. Had to look up the size - borrowing macho names from the Ford US catalogue doesn’t help - but it’s less than 4.5m long, so iX1 or EX40 sized, rather than the iX3 competitor I first thought it might be. Quite a neat looking package, but so are the others and I suspect they have better interiors, if less impressive range claims.
You can have one in a nice silvery blue, though. Humph would like that.
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bpg
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Post by bpg on Mar 26, 2024 14:37:07 GMT
For direct comparison a fully loaded KIA Niro is €54,590, a KIA Soul in the same spec I have is over €52,000. For the Niro, KIA have moved the heat pump onto the options list.
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Post by Humph on Mar 26, 2024 14:46:38 GMT
I wonder if I would actually like any of those yet, colour notwithstanding. I guess it’s possible, but unlikely to be probable. If I suddenly wanted to drop 50 grand on something to not go very far in, then I’d look a bit harder at them I suppose. Right now, I’ll pass thanks. Carry on the good work, someone has to do the R&D. Most grateful etc. 😉
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bpg
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Post by bpg on Mar 26, 2024 14:56:24 GMT
Someone already did for your Jeep. A fully spec'd Renegade hybrid is €53,260. They're all in the ballpark. Cars have jumped significantly in price since 2020 don't forget.
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Rob
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Post by Rob on Mar 26, 2024 17:32:19 GMT
WdB you comments about high mileage EVs and rapid charging is what I was getting at in another thread. I'd not buy a very high mileage EV that's done a lot of miles in a short time because it must have been rapid charged. And they might not have been worried about keeping it below 80% charge either.
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