bpg
Full Member
Posts: 2,811
|
Post by bpg on Jul 30, 2023 20:47:07 GMT
I've read today the UK PM wants to defer this to local authorities. I'm not so sure.
Surely this should follow a standard model ? Some areas may choose to have extended hours with higher people/vehicle concentration. The principle should be the same and the signage standardised otherwise you'll end up with chaotic ZTL system of Italy where the notification of when it's active and not varies from town to town.
I understand why they may be needed. Possibly start outside schools 1 hour before start of school until 30 minutes after school starts and similar in the afternoon.
If it is not done correctly you'll end up with situation similar to Edinburgh. The bus lane local variances are too great and people take the path of least resistance which is to avoid using the bus lanes at any time. This reduces the road capacity by 50% and increases congestion.
|
|
|
|
Post by bromptonaut on Aug 2, 2023 9:01:01 GMT
My understanding was the other way - the PM has suggested he would like to reduce the power of Councils to introduce LTNs and also 20 limits. This is the first government I've been aware of that's trying to wind back Devolution both to the UK's nations and local government. Mostly it's part of what I, admittedly a member of the Labour Party, see as trying to turn all sorts of issues into wedges where the Tories put themselves about as speaking for 'ordinary' people.
LTN's are, AIUI, mostly about encouraging walking/cycling for local trips. This is achieved by making some roads either residents/permit holders only or no through roads. The other effect is to reduce 'rat running' through residential streets. My own experience with Sat Nav in (eg) Outer London is that it'll try and send me off the main drag and round wholly residential streets to nip out what are literally seconds. Noticed it particularly in the Stanmore/Belmont area as I lived there 40 years ago and still have a reasonable mental map of routes between A and B.
|
|
|
|
Post by EspadaIII on Aug 2, 2023 13:29:11 GMT
I use Waze a lot for traffic/journey speed than directions. I would support a proposal that stopped navigation systems from suggesting a route which saved less than say 5% of the journey time by using local residential roads.
We haven't faced LTNs here but I understand that some of these create situations where emergency vehicles cannot get to where they need to go. Improving the environment for walkers and cyclists is good but it cannot be at the expense of other's safety.
|
|
|
|
Post by bromptonaut on Aug 2, 2023 13:38:29 GMT
I use Waze a lot for traffic/journey speed than directions. I would support a proposal that stopped navigation systems from suggesting a route which saved less than say 5% of the journey time by using local residential roads. We haven't faced LTNs here but I understand that some of these create situations where emergency vehicles cannot get to where they need to go. Improving the environment for walkers and cyclists is good but it cannot be at the expense of other's safety. If what's said about emergency vehicles is true - there's a lot said about LTNs that needs a large pinch of salt - then that absolutely needs sorting. TAlking of Sat Nav oddities I've found that in areas of Victorian or Edwardian terraces, student Liverpool off Smithdown Rd was one and locally round Abington Park another, Google thinks I should go down the narrow lanes, really just big ginnels, between one terrace and the next. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2023 13:47:53 GMT
What's a ginnel? Is it like a snicket?
|
|
WDB
Full Member
Posts: 7,425 
|
Post by WDB on Aug 2, 2023 13:55:41 GMT
I use Waze a lot for traffic/journey speed… This was fine when only a minority of drivers had navigation assistance. Then those that did were at a genuine advantage and could avoid traffic problems that caught everyone else. Now that it’s near-universal, navigation only re-routes everybody on to the same alternative and nobody gains a second. I had an example of this coming back from Wales via Telford. As we approached Birmingham on the M6, Fräulein Navi must have changed her mind half a dozen times, each one presumably prompted by her Route n+1 turning out to be no quicker than Route n because everyone else’s nav was working with the same information and offering the same advice. I followed her twice, then found myself back on the M6 (her idea) and just stuck with it (not her idea.) I would probably behave saved time if I’d ignored her from the start. |
|
|
|
Post by EspadaIII on Aug 2, 2023 16:04:45 GMT
Yes - happens to me that as well. Sometimes you have to accept that you are in a jam and sit there.
Local knowledge is useful as well, but then that only works if you turn Satnav off and actually have local knowledge..
|
|
|
|
Post by bromptonaut on Aug 2, 2023 20:36:07 GMT
What's a ginnel? Is it like a snicket? More like an alley... |
|
|
|
Post by Humph on Aug 2, 2023 20:45:36 GMT
Which is a bit like a close.
|
|
|
|
Post by EspadaIII on Aug 3, 2023 12:27:11 GMT
It's not a Close! A close is far too suburban for a ginnel.
|
|
|
|
Post by Humph on Aug 3, 2023 13:01:27 GMT
|
|
