WDB
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Post by WDB on Aug 19, 2016 15:09:20 GMT
You live in a much longer country than I do. I've never had to make an unexpected trip of that length, and if I did it would be of sufficient urgency for a few hundred quid on taxis or train fares not to matter. I'd take it out of the savings I'd made in Road Fuel Duty.
A wider problem is that most of us overspecify our cars, catering for the occasional rather than the everyday. The obvious example is of most cars being driven with empty seats, but you could argue it's hugely wasteful to drive a car that's only used to full capacity for one trip a year. I'm pointing at myself here: the LEC swallows our holiday gear without requiring a roof box; does that mean it's the right car for us, or that for most of the year it's just too big?
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Post by Hofmeister on Aug 19, 2016 15:22:48 GMT
For unplanned and unforeseen stuff. I have a cell phone and various cordless phones around the house. But I also have a wired phone, just in case. Similarly even though an electric car would work for me 99% of the time, I'd want a petrol car sat there just in case I needed to go 500 miles at a moments notice. No even for planned stuff. You want to drive to the Vendee, The Alps?, Venice? on your booked planned holiday? you cant plan to do it in a Tesla. (you could I guess, in 300 mile hops from Tesla charging point to charging point, if they exist on route and if your destination has one) I know I can plug my phone into the mains and use it while its charging. My Tesla cant do that. I accept that a tesla as a car works, both for looks, desirability, and drivability, but to try and justify it on cost grounds without budgeting in another car is dishonest.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2016 15:24:59 GMT
If I bought a care for purely functional reasons driven by need, then the drive would look quite different. However, a lot of what I look for in a car is not driven by strict need.
And part of what I want is a feeling of comfort. Not because I think that I am suddenly going to need to drive 500 miles, or 200 if you like. But so that I know I can if I need/want to.
Your son will go to Uni; could quite easily be 150 / 200 miles away. Fancy hunting around for taxis or train fares when he calls in trouble at 1.00am on Christmas day? Of course it won't happen; but rather than trying to think of all the things I haven't thought of, their relative likelihood, and mitigation and management approaches, I'd rather have another form of transport sat there just in case.
Similarly, there is never a time when all of my cars are low on gas. One is always full.
These days electric starts on bikes make perfect sense, who needs a kick start as well. In the early days you abso-bloody-lutely wanted a kick start as well. I suspect that this will be similar. 5 years from now, perhaps not. But today? Damn right.
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Aug 19, 2016 16:02:06 GMT
You want to drive to the Vendee, The Alps?, Venice? on your booked planned holiday? you cant plan to do it in a Tesla. (you could I guess, in 300 mile hops from Tesla charging point to charging point, if they exist on route and if your destination has one) Funnily, that's one of the first things we talked about. I'd mentioned we'd just come back from France, so Miss Tesla got the car to plot a route from West Drayton to Vichy via the Tunnel. It suggested a half-hour Supercharge at Maidstone on the M20, and another at Bourges. Not so different from the stops we'd make for fuel and leakage anyway. I used to do road trips through France in petrol cars with a typical range of 350 miles, so this isn't so very different. Yes, it would take some planning - perhaps an overnight stop with a charging point, which again will only become more common. And I'd probably have to own up to my host that I'd be charging the car from the gîte's domestic supply. But these are behavioural adjustments, not fundamental differences. And they'll be even smaller five years from now. I wouldn't go on holiday in a Nissan Leaf - I think Nissan gives Leaf owners use of a combuster for a few days a year to cover this - but I might well in a Tesla.
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Aug 19, 2016 16:04:57 GMT
Another thought: how long till ferries and Le Shuttle trains offer Supercharger spaces? That way we could take off into France with the first half of the journey already provided for.
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Post by Hofmeister on Aug 19, 2016 16:14:50 GMT
Another thought: how long till ferries and Le Shuttle trains offer Supercharger spaces? That way we could take off into France with the first half of the journey already provided for. Its a desirable solution, but kin difficult to install. Do-able, just, on a ship where they have some chance of sticking particular cars in particular places, (they wont like doing it, slows them down) but there is lack of deck space to put the infrastructure in place. As for the train, they have enough agro getting sufficient current to the loco traction motors, let alone throwing kilowatts into hungry Teslas, and how would ensure where to put them in a long tube with cars going in one end and out the other? Nice but no dice.
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Aug 19, 2016 16:28:17 GMT
Soluble, surely. They manage to accommodate roofboxes and trailers by flagging them at the loading stage and inserting them in the correct sequence.
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Post by Hofmeister on Aug 19, 2016 16:44:36 GMT
Soluble, surely. They manage to accommodate roofboxes and trailers by flagging them at the loading stage and inserting them in the correct sequence. Into roughly the right part of the train, with the coaches and the vans. Lots of them. You cant put a tesla fast charging point into each possible landing spot, nor can you have them dangling over floor of the coach as its an emergency gangway. And then what about the non tesla cars to be charged who cant use the fast charge ports? And you still have the pickup at 140kmh from the cateneray for possibly a hundred extra KW issue. Soluble? no thats for Aspirin, solvable? of course it is, everything is but at what cost? cost that the non tesla user will have to finance in higher fares, and speaking as a non tesla but normal shuttle user YCFRO (ask me if you need to know what that last bit means)
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Aug 19, 2016 16:58:02 GMT
They needn't be Tesla-specific - although they might not be as quick. A Tesla can charge from an ordinary charging point too. And you could equip one wagon for charging, put it at the front or back of the train and not get in anyone else's way. The charging cables are short and tidy anyway, and hang up like pump hoses, so there should be no worries about emergency routes. The hardware could hang from the ceiling out of everyone's way.
Tesla's website has a section on 'destination charging', offering subsidies to hotels, restaurants and the like for installing Tesla chargers in prominent places. They're obviously keen to expand the network, so don't assume the long-suffering Lancer owner would get stuck with the bill.
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Post by Hofmeister on Aug 19, 2016 19:04:51 GMT
Meanwhile back in the real world, I can guarantee you two things. 1/ there will be no Tesla fast charging points on le Shuttle, and 2/ you wont be buying a Tesla.
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Aug 19, 2016 22:14:27 GMT
Meanwhile back in the real world, I can guarantee you two things. 1/ there will be no Tesla fast charging points on le Shuttle, and 2/ you wont be buying a Tesla. Please yourself. What happened to 'discussion'?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2016 22:35:31 GMT
I am prepared to bet you a shitload of dosh that there will be charging points on the shuttle. The only argument is how long it will take.
I am waiting to see what the secondhand Tesla market will look like. After my S Class and my Phaeton I am right off the depreciation involved in buying new cars.
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Post by Hofmeister on Aug 20, 2016 8:18:04 GMT
Meanwhile back in the real world, I can guarantee you two things. 1/ there will be no Tesla fast charging points on le Shuttle, and 2/ you wont be buying a Tesla. Please yourself. What happened to 'discussion'? This is discussion, this is a viewpoint, an opinion on a likely outcome. Discussion is not "Yes Mr WDB, you are right Mr WDB, say something else so we can all agree with you Mr WDB" Lets try another tack, as this is about "man maths" Over 36 months, 36k miles ( a not untypical ownership/lease profile you will agree) could you achieve that in a Tesla without access to another car at any point. If you cant, you have to agree that has to be factored into the TCO. Are there any real life unbiased factual UK ownership experiences out there? Ones over a sufficient period of time to be meaningful?
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Post by Hofmeister on Aug 20, 2016 8:22:22 GMT
I am prepared to bet you a shitload of dosh that there will be charging points on the shuttle. The only argument is how long it will take. I am waiting to see what the secondhand Tesla market will look like. After my S Class and my Phaeton I am right off the depreciation involved in buying new cars. Heres an eye opener for you. AT Ashurst New Forest Station, there is an appeal poster from the Police for witnesses from what sounds like a fairly typical anonymous car park incident (its not a big car park, very small and very tight, nothing could have been done at speed) The aggrieved party is a Tesla owner, where £9k of damage was caused!
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Post by Hofmeister on Aug 20, 2016 8:24:48 GMT
I am prepared to bet you a shitload of dosh that there will be charging points on the shuttle. The only argument is how long it will take. I am waiting to see what the secondhand Tesla market will look like. After my S Class and my Phaeton I am right off the depreciation involved in buying new cars. I'm assuming there wont be a second hand Tesla market in your locale. I doubt Chilly is high on Tesla's export drive. Can you imagine your LLWS being presented with one of those to service?
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