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Post by EspadaIII on Jan 4, 2022 17:13:21 GMT
So what do we think? 600,000 demand removal of knighthoodThe Prime Minister does not recommend these particular honours to HMQ, so presumably she personally thinks it is time for him to have some form of honour to recognise his premiership for such a long period despite his obvious faults. |
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Jan 4, 2022 20:58:57 GMT
His government reduced social inequality by more than any other in the modern era. It did a lot of good, much of which, sadly, has been systematically undone since 2010. Johnson’s much-trumpeted ‘levelling up’ has achieved almost nothing.
Iraq was a grievous error, and not just in hindsight. But the Tories supported it and would have been even keener to ride Bush’s coattails had they been in charge at the time.
So on balance: yes, the Blair years did a lot more good than harm. And were enormously better than what we’ve had since.
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Jan 5, 2022 14:52:12 GMT
It’s fascinating that Blair remains a target of the rightwing press fifteen years after he left office. I suspect it’s because he was able to command majority support for the kind of progressive social reform that still gives the likes of Paul Dacre and Charles Moore nightmares, so they must never allow it to happen again.
Also note that for each person who’s signed this petition, there are a hundred who haven’t.
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Post by EspadaIII on Jan 5, 2022 16:12:16 GMT
I certainly haven't signed it and I'm not sure it is all right wing people who have. So many on the left hate Blair because of the Iraq dossier etc. It is a real mix. I am not anti-Blair; not my favourite person; I thought him smug and certainly controlled by his awful wife who he enriched via legislation relating to Human Rights. But he did also do a lot of good; anyone who manages to stay in power in an elected democracy for that length of time must have made life better for a large part of the population.
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Post by Humph on Jan 5, 2022 16:36:31 GMT
I used to care about these things. Quite a lot actually, politics and the way the country was being run had always been a keen interest of mine.
But, I find that I increasingly just don’t give a flying fig about any of it anymore. Any delusions I had about there being some honest politicians with the best interests of the country at their core have proven mainly naive.
In fact I can honestly say, that I have never felt so politically disenfranchised. I wish I didn’t, but I simply can’t even be bothered to think about it anymore.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2022 21:26:42 GMT
>>Any delusions I had about there being some honest politicians with the best interests of the country at their core have proven mainly naive.
If there are any then they are well hidden.
I don't like party politics anyway, my thoughts do not fit neatly and exclusively into one of two and a half boxes, but it seems even more pointless and futile when both sides are so well armed with incompetence, selfishness and self-righteousness. They're not even competent at being shit.
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Post by EspadaIII on Jan 7, 2022 8:55:41 GMT
And the ones who complain the most about corruption are the ones one wouldn't trust to run the parish council let alone the country.
Mind you I did like the suggestion that we should all be governed by women. We would then really have someone to blame if it went tits up....
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Jan 7, 2022 9:37:50 GMT
And the ones who complain the most about corruption are the ones one wouldn't trust to run the parish council let alone the country. Really? Such as…? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2022 16:48:41 GMT
>>And the ones who complain the most about corruption are the ones one wouldn't trust to run the parish council let alone the country
Got to stop you there. I have a problem with virtually all professional politicians, but much less with amateurs. Or near amateurs.
Running a Parish Council, Village Hall committee, PTA, local charity or any such similar, is a thankless task. If you do not feel personally driven to do so, financially able to do so, and satisfied with your own approval then you would never do it. Yet it needs doing.
Inevitably the motivation of such a person is not always going to be suitable for the role, it's the human race, but I think incompetence is far more prevalent than corruption or malevolence
We are quick to deride, criticise, hound, mock and disrespect those roles and the people in them, even when the subject's motivations are pure. Yet we're very slow to step up to the plate ourselves.
It's just easier to throw rocks I guess.
Why would *you* do it? Or would you simply not?
I run a charity. I love it, and get a real kick out of it and I do it partly because it's the right thing to do and partly because I enjoy it - in equal measures probably. It's an education. If you've never done it, try it. None of us make enough difference in this world, try making more.
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Post by EspadaIII on Jan 9, 2022 14:43:53 GMT
As someone who has sat on the board as a Trustee of three multi-million turnover charities I know exactly what sort of person I am talking about. Most politicians of any party would be hopeless as they grandstand. You need people who 'do'. I stepped down from all three when I realised that my role was no longer needed and others would benefit from my knowledge and expertise.
Most parish councils are party politics free, hence most politicians would not be suitable.
So no need to have a go...
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WDB
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Post by WDB on Jan 9, 2022 21:05:37 GMT
Actual 'doing', at national and even city / regional level, is for civil servants. Providing the policy direction and presentation for that is a different task, and that's what politicians are for. This is why the 'we need someone who can run a business / hospital / laundrette' argument is fallacious; it answers the wrong question.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2022 21:26:49 GMT
Whilst you are quite correct, certainly at national/ regional level, we need the politicians, and those who vote for them, to also grasp that distinction and separation. Typically they do not.
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Post by dixinormus on Jan 9, 2022 22:08:48 GMT
Blair sold us the notion that Iraq had “WMD”. They didn’t. The UN didn’t give Blair a mandate to go to war but he did regardless. Detestable.
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Rob
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Post by Rob on Jan 10, 2022 0:16:53 GMT
Not only were we told the WMD were there but they could also be deployed in 45 minutes if I am remembering correctly. If they had found them buried somewhere and ultimately useable would be different to what we'd been told but they didn't find them. But was Blair and government more guilty of what they had been told? Would a Tory government at the time do anything different? There was backing by MPs albeit they based their response on invalid info. But I'm not convinced about the official outcome of the investigation into David Kelly's death. Indeed was there an outcome...? I just Google'd this and the inquest never completed. I blame Novax Djcovid  |
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